Slash vs women

[beccaelizabeth]

I used to be in fandoms where there were mostly Babes of the Week. They existed solely to have UST with one of the guys, and then at the end of the episode the women went away and the guys went home together. So we ignored the women, because the only real relationship was these two guys who cared about each other more than anything else in their lives. Hence, slash.

But that was a while ago, and there are TV shows with actual women in. Persistent characters with agendas of their own. People as well rounded as the guys ever were. And some of them are dating guys. But TV being TV, they usually break up eventually, or someone gets fridged, or they leave for a spin off show. So I guess I felt like, okay, looking at this, the key relationship? Still two guys. So, more slash.

But now it’s creeping me out: There are women who never break up with their guys, who maybe get married to their guys, who have rings and commitment and stick by them through thick and thin and the world exploding. But we’re in the habit now. We go looking for the two guys. And way too much of the time, we’re the ones who break them up, or fridge them, or figure someone else will write their spin off show. Sometimes we even rewrite whole episodes so the guy gets the girl’s role. And I’ve been reading it, because hey, still slash.

But seriously, what the hell?

I know a lot of good reasons to write slash. I’d dearly love it if more canonical media wrote a wider range of sexualities and relationships. I like this aesthetic we’ve got in slash where working out your relationships and sex life and saving the world a lot are all just part of the one life story, all different parts of being a person, all interesting.

But it’s creeping me out, how much easier it is to find fic where the women are erased than fic where we’re celebrated.

My favourite fanfics now are poly. Because the fandoms have actually already got great het relationships with great female characters, so instead of erasing anything, we just add a little. Or a lot. It’s all good.

But it creeps me out on TV when there’s a show that kills off all the women, silences them, makes them serve the guys’ plots. And it double creeps me out in fanfic, where we’re pleasing no one but ourselves, and the same damn problems crop up.

I want to exist in my stories. Why so difficult?

Comments

[havocthecat]

Generally not, as a matter of fact. It happens sometimes - as it also happens sometimes in het with either gender of rival (usually women, I'll be honest) - but it's generally frowned upon and there has been negative talk about it for years.

[baronjanus]

Glad to know it's a nicer space :)
Mind, there's been negative talk about this post's topic too - the treatment of women by m/m slashers - for years, but things don't get that much better.

[havocthecat]

Oh, you're absolutely right about the fact that there's been talk about this post's topic for years. I've been one of the people doing the talking about that. I don't know whether it's gotten much better; I don't tend to read much m/m slash. But the fact is that m/m slashers are doing some of the talking about it now, and I find that highly encouraging.

[baronjanus]

No, no, what I meant is that m/m slahers have been ranting about this for years :) I was around for that (so was Becca, I'm sure), nodding and agreeing and trying to do better. And this was before the big boom of... I'm not even sure when and how it happened, but there's a lot more visibility and a LOT more people around now than there were. Which is cool! Very cool. But also means ancient discussions are brought up because it seems not enough had improved over the ages.


(my first hit on the random icon button wins again!)

[havocthecat]

I think a lot of the talk maybe was kept within m/m slasher circles, then, because I haven't heard about it from that direction until the past maybe five years. I'm glad that it's expanding! Because, like I said, I've been having this conversation for years myself, but until five years ago I was always told I was wrong and I didn't get it. And again, I've never thought that all m/m slashers are like that!

I would like to see a permanent level of improvement, though, and seeing the discussions become more visible always helps - or helps me feel better, at least.