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beccaelizabethToday I rewatched Doomworld episode of Legends of Tomorrow.
Doom!Snart exists for very different purposes to regular Snart, so I can see why the story development wants him to treat Mick that way, but I remain unconvinced and think it's a cheap thing to do to a partnership.
It makes most sense to me as an in universe retcon, a result of what Len did to his own history when he tried to save his dad. If he thinks When It All Went Wrong is the clumsy poorly done heist then he focuses on skill, but this guy Never Trusts Anyone, and his dad got screwed over by trusting the wrong person. It's a plausible result of changing his own past, but I don't see how that guy maintains the long term partnership.
So then there's the thing where the other villains recruited him and treat him like he'll jump when they order. I think after what they did to Rip you'd have to come up with reasons why they *wouldn't* do all that to Snart, try and control him etc. Merlyn drugged his own daughter, he's unlikely to hold back with the hired help, and Dark handed out mind control pills like vitamins. So why would they just not do that to Snart?
Mick not being mind controlled has been covered : many have tried, and it did not go well for them.
Also everyone underestimates him.
The Legends do not treat him well this year.
He took the chance to save his partner and then found this weird flattened world instead. And it has to be new to him when they rob that bank, so whatever Rip says about being in the ship for so long, it hasn't been that long for Mick. ... unless they were busy doing other non crime stuff before then. ... like hey my partner is back from the dead stuff. :-/
So he saved Nate, and started to fix things.
And he stood still and let *three* of them hit him. When he's the guy that won't put up with chest poking. That was pretty emphatic as guilt apologies go.
But the team don't trust him.
Going to Snart about it seems very much like they were right.
Consider though the same math we had around the pirates situation in year one. The person you were depending on for survival says they don't want you around. What do you do? Trust them anyway?
The show keeps saying Mick would have been right to do so, but since when?
Len and the ice gun vs Amaya... that's a different guy than we last saw in Central City, he'd only actually killed two guys with it that I remember, one by accident and one his dad. Sure it has always been capable, but the gun never did that freezing solid thing before, so the physics just changed specifically so Snart can make a pun. And, as far as Snart and anyone knows, Amaya was actively in the process of trying to kill Snart. Makes it self defence. Even if he managed to sound The Most Jealous.
It's a right mess, designed to change Mick and the viewer, and it's just not treating Snart like a main character any more. Cillains catalyse the heroes, so that's all he is doing.
Messy.
The other thing though, Eobard Thawne.
I realise the story keeps on trying to make it amply and emphatically clear that he is The Bad Guy, but like, badly?
Given the power to do anything, rewrite the world to be anything, he gave it clean energy, clean water, and a better tomorrow. Then he locked it off.
Such evil. Much bad.
And yes, the way he was treating people? Clearly not only a bad thing but a bad idea.
Just, the thing in the moonshot episode where he points out what Ray *could* be doing with his tech, and isn't, in terms of saving the world in a non punching way? Eobard grew up with the results. And if he was in the future Legends season one saw, Ray's tech is the face of a lot of appalling things. Combine what these science heroes of the past didn't do and what they did do and you get the world Eobard became a speedster to... well, that story changes pretty often. Did he need to save it? As of one season ago, someone did. As of this season, might be saved already. Who knows.
Eobard's little speech, the one that leads to almost everyone walking out alive?
Votes for that being about himself much?
The upcoming losing his temper and murdering people is as ever a problem
where the story slams the door closed on alternatives for him or anyone
but there are some layers of nuance under there
if anyone wants to play with them.
Characters who exist as full people with insides and motives and consistent characterisation
vs characters who exist solely to stir and steer those other guys
gets a bit frustrating.
It doesn't feel like a great time to be a villain fan
but it do seem like a good time to remember everyone is a person, not a villain.
Tricky.
I am stalling a bit on finishing the season and may switch to another show after that.
This bit was not my favourite.
Doom!Snart exists for very different purposes to regular Snart, so I can see why the story development wants him to treat Mick that way, but I remain unconvinced and think it's a cheap thing to do to a partnership.
It makes most sense to me as an in universe retcon, a result of what Len did to his own history when he tried to save his dad. If he thinks When It All Went Wrong is the clumsy poorly done heist then he focuses on skill, but this guy Never Trusts Anyone, and his dad got screwed over by trusting the wrong person. It's a plausible result of changing his own past, but I don't see how that guy maintains the long term partnership.
So then there's the thing where the other villains recruited him and treat him like he'll jump when they order. I think after what they did to Rip you'd have to come up with reasons why they *wouldn't* do all that to Snart, try and control him etc. Merlyn drugged his own daughter, he's unlikely to hold back with the hired help, and Dark handed out mind control pills like vitamins. So why would they just not do that to Snart?
Mick not being mind controlled has been covered : many have tried, and it did not go well for them.
Also everyone underestimates him.
The Legends do not treat him well this year.
He took the chance to save his partner and then found this weird flattened world instead. And it has to be new to him when they rob that bank, so whatever Rip says about being in the ship for so long, it hasn't been that long for Mick. ... unless they were busy doing other non crime stuff before then. ... like hey my partner is back from the dead stuff. :-/
So he saved Nate, and started to fix things.
And he stood still and let *three* of them hit him. When he's the guy that won't put up with chest poking. That was pretty emphatic as guilt apologies go.
But the team don't trust him.
Going to Snart about it seems very much like they were right.
Consider though the same math we had around the pirates situation in year one. The person you were depending on for survival says they don't want you around. What do you do? Trust them anyway?
The show keeps saying Mick would have been right to do so, but since when?
Len and the ice gun vs Amaya... that's a different guy than we last saw in Central City, he'd only actually killed two guys with it that I remember, one by accident and one his dad. Sure it has always been capable, but the gun never did that freezing solid thing before, so the physics just changed specifically so Snart can make a pun. And, as far as Snart and anyone knows, Amaya was actively in the process of trying to kill Snart. Makes it self defence. Even if he managed to sound The Most Jealous.
It's a right mess, designed to change Mick and the viewer, and it's just not treating Snart like a main character any more. Cillains catalyse the heroes, so that's all he is doing.
Messy.
The other thing though, Eobard Thawne.
I realise the story keeps on trying to make it amply and emphatically clear that he is The Bad Guy, but like, badly?
Given the power to do anything, rewrite the world to be anything, he gave it clean energy, clean water, and a better tomorrow. Then he locked it off.
Such evil. Much bad.
And yes, the way he was treating people? Clearly not only a bad thing but a bad idea.
Just, the thing in the moonshot episode where he points out what Ray *could* be doing with his tech, and isn't, in terms of saving the world in a non punching way? Eobard grew up with the results. And if he was in the future Legends season one saw, Ray's tech is the face of a lot of appalling things. Combine what these science heroes of the past didn't do and what they did do and you get the world Eobard became a speedster to... well, that story changes pretty often. Did he need to save it? As of one season ago, someone did. As of this season, might be saved already. Who knows.
Eobard's little speech, the one that leads to almost everyone walking out alive?
And the truth is, I don't want
to see any more of you dead.
Not out of sentiment, of course.
No, no, quite the opposite.
But because it is so...
delicious,
knowing that you'll be
forced to live your lives
in a reality that I...
Well, that we created.
You will walk this world knowing
that something isn't quite right,
that for all your trying
you only made things worse,
and no one will ever believe
you when you tell them
about all the sacrifices you made
and how close you came to being Legends.
Now, that sounds like a
fitting punishment to me.
Votes for that being about himself much?
The upcoming losing his temper and murdering people is as ever a problem
where the story slams the door closed on alternatives for him or anyone
but there are some layers of nuance under there
if anyone wants to play with them.
Characters who exist as full people with insides and motives and consistent characterisation
vs characters who exist solely to stir and steer those other guys
gets a bit frustrating.
It doesn't feel like a great time to be a villain fan
but it do seem like a good time to remember everyone is a person, not a villain.
Tricky.
I am stalling a bit on finishing the season and may switch to another show after that.
This bit was not my favourite.