Captain America: The Winter Soldier
Apr. 6th, 2014 04:22 pm![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
beccaelizabeth:-D
Whoosh! Boom! Eeeeee!
Wanna see it again!
Really, the screen showing the 2D version was scheduled so as soon as it finished they clean up and let the next set of people in, and I soooooo wanted to go right around and get another ticket. But I knew that wasn't a viable plan for today. I was feeling pretty awesome about the world right then, but I was also sitting and rocking and doing the hand stims and unable to make coherent grown up sentences, and then about a half hour after the movie finished I was All Done and suddenly everything was too bright and too loud and I would quite like to sleep but I was still in Norwich. But that was okay because I went with mum and sibling and we all got home together. Also we took refuge from the Loud in the bookshop and I got a book and ordered the next Hawkeye volume. So today was full of yaay.
So, I'd like to have big thoughts about this movie, because woah was it full of STUFF...
... but I think I needed to go sleep at 1500 and it's now 1630. And I typoed most of this post so far. So.
Only have a couple things to say. SPOILERS for Captain America: The Winter Soldier, and also references to Agents of SHIELD up to TAHITI. NO SPOILERS for future Agents of SHIELD, I'm watching along at British TV speed.
SPOILERS under the cut:
I might have mentioned this morning that I didn't see why Fury wouldn't just talk to Coulson. While the point holds in general for much of the season thus far, depending on timing, Fury had some excellent reasons to be unavailable right here, at around the same time SHIELD medical personnel would also be vanished. I don't know what the timeline is meant to be, how those match up, but, pretty good reasons right there. Only I think the relevant xover episode is still a few weeks away, in which case my point would stand.
Also, was saying to mum, whole series is called Agents of SHIELD. Er, name change?
... Blakes 7 stayed Blakes 7 for years after no more Blake, and their identity probably fits the title even after SHIELD go boom.
And what a way to go boom. Also, I must apologise to the Agents of SHIELD writers, because I didn't know if they knew when SHIELD was being evil. I strongly suspect they do in fact know. Because BOOM! Hydra.
:-D
I was wondering if that was a wimp out, in that it's a way to not claim responsibility for anything SHIELD has ever done wrong, and that's so to some extent. BUT, mostly, I love it, because of who they made HYDRA. Humanity can't be trusted with its own freedom, so they have to be led into giving it up. That... that is such an excellent pitch. Because I can totally see SHIELD and HYDRA having everything in common, with that as the basis. That is the line SHIELD runs right up against, even on its best day, with the best of intentions. I can see an organisation with that as its guiding principle gaining converts. Cause it's like when nazis thought they'd identified evil and could get rid of it once and for all, only with a modern gloss of computers and guns from above. HYDRA becomes the people who think they really can enforce peace through superior firepower and intelligence.
... Tony is going to feel like shit about this one. Seriously, epically, his tech has been part of the near apocalypse, his trust has been screwed over, and he's going to blame himself and be paranoid as all hell. His name was one of the targets, but still, he's going to feel awful.
And he's only tangential to SHIELD.
Actual SHIELD agents? Are one and all going to have to re-evaluate their whole lives.
Because the monster is right there in the mirror, and has been all along.
:-D
HYDRA's plan wouldn't work. For one, they'd used fear of violence from others as the incentive to build up their own 'defensive' forces - suddenly openly becoming the threat would trigger all the responses they'd worked on so carefully, but in a mass reaction against HYDRA. They'd need to maintain the lie to keep the sheeple. But also, the more you tighten your grasp, the more systems slip through your fingers. ... people like to be rebels. Or, more seriously, the more violence happens, the more people have a personal incentive to rethink everything. So I'm pretty sure their plan was a stupid plan, but it was such a Lawful Evil plan I can see why they think it's super smart.
I'm not sure believing the giant face in the computer was the best way to find it out though.
SHIELD being poisoned at source by bringing that guy in... wait, did it say 1972? Because that could be when the SSR people were leaving and replacement people were all how bad could he be. But, poisoned at source by thinking you can use the weapons and science of the enemy? Iiiiiiinteresting.
Also, poor Howard. (And he was murdered by HYDRA in this 'verse? Story!)
Peggy :-)
There were so many good bits.
I like Falcon. Possibly I like him best? Whoosh! Wheee! ... I maybe just like people that fly and/or fall out of buildings on hope. That... actually does cover Tony, Clint, and now Falcon.
I like his background.
Bucky!
Many people left before the end of the credits. Why do people do that?
It's a Marvel movie. Y'all should know by now to wait until the end end of the credits. It's totally worth it.
I was so holding my breath waiting for things to work better for him. (I liked the stuff on tumblr about how Steve should princess kiss him better cause Marvel is Disney now. That would be awesome.) But I guess we will have to wait for more story?
I know from fanfic and fan osmosis a lot about Natasha and Bucky, and I was... puzzled by some of the story choices around Black Widow here. I mean, she's an interesting character if she's actually for reals born in 1984, but she's also pretty interesting in the comics with epic backstory. And someone who doesn't have the same backstory isn't the same person? So why do that? But okay, she's newer.
Black Widow is awesome. She kicked so much arse. Awesome.
I still want to see a movie which is actually about Marvel women. And maybe some merch in the meantime? Even my mum has noticed there's no women, except from her available data she has concluded there are no girl superheroes. She has gone to all these Marvel movies with me and she thinks there are no girl superheroes. That's just fail on Marvel's part. We went in the shops after the movie looking for shiny that must be ours, and in optimum mood for superhero acquisition, but there were only guys, so nothing got bought.
Given the memory tech demonstrated on Bucky and Coulson (and if HYDRA is in SHIELD it's the same tech, yesno?) what Black Widow thinks she knows about Black Widow is not actually the last word on it. Which is weird. But also, Bucky now has a finding himself storyline, right, and a trying to have agency and independence story, and that's a pretty awesome set of stories. Ones often female characters get? Guys fight to save world, women fight to have selves. So that's interesting.
Steve Rogers and girlfriends (and Natasha trying to set him up with, like, all the women) ... several tumblr posts have pointed out that Falcon is the love interest in this. He gets the meet cute, he gets the story bringing him together with Cap, Cap seeking him out just to talk, and then the chance to be there for him. Declares his allegiance full clear. I liked the phrasing, the way the whole 'on your left' bit played through. So the whole movie was about getting them together. That was cute.
So I kind of like that there's a friendship prioritised over the being set up with a girl, and the whole thing with Falcon is super cute, but...
... just niggly stuff, really.
Setting up all the women in his life to be on the wrong side of the lied to him / trust equation? Not actually cool.
It was funny when Natasha was trying to help Steve blend in. Steve is all ready to fight everyone, not so much ready to hide. It's fun watching him be bad at lying and sneaking and, er, acting like an average person. Also I liked that Natasha explained the 'kiss' cover and there was no pouncing.
Some people will probably see this movie and see Steve/Natasha. I see Steve&Natasha, with, like, lots of underlining.
The bad at kissing conversation was kind of funny, except for it being nobody's business. Only now everyone's going to wonder who he's been kissing. Available answers are all wrapped up in tragic.
I don't know why they did that Agent 13 stuff the way they did. I mean, wiki will tell who she is, why introduce that way?
... I may be rearranging the story in my head right now to be more about women.
But there's women to work with, so yaays?
But to watch it was a most excellent experience. I loved the action sequences, to the point of incoherence and big swoopy re-enactment gestures on the way out of the cinema. Whoosh! Boom! But in with all the whoosh I got to really like the characters. All of them. It was great.
Things I liked about the movie: ALL of it!
Things I didn't liked: I got tired and couldn't watch it again straight away.
And excellent about after the film: This movie is going to make soooooo much story :-)
[ETA for those linked here: More Winter Soldier and Agents of SHIELD 1.14 TAHITI have related thoughts]
Whoosh! Boom! Eeeeee!
Wanna see it again!
Really, the screen showing the 2D version was scheduled so as soon as it finished they clean up and let the next set of people in, and I soooooo wanted to go right around and get another ticket. But I knew that wasn't a viable plan for today. I was feeling pretty awesome about the world right then, but I was also sitting and rocking and doing the hand stims and unable to make coherent grown up sentences, and then about a half hour after the movie finished I was All Done and suddenly everything was too bright and too loud and I would quite like to sleep but I was still in Norwich. But that was okay because I went with mum and sibling and we all got home together. Also we took refuge from the Loud in the bookshop and I got a book and ordered the next Hawkeye volume. So today was full of yaay.
So, I'd like to have big thoughts about this movie, because woah was it full of STUFF...
... but I think I needed to go sleep at 1500 and it's now 1630. And I typoed most of this post so far. So.
Only have a couple things to say. SPOILERS for Captain America: The Winter Soldier, and also references to Agents of SHIELD up to TAHITI. NO SPOILERS for future Agents of SHIELD, I'm watching along at British TV speed.
SPOILERS under the cut:
I might have mentioned this morning that I didn't see why Fury wouldn't just talk to Coulson. While the point holds in general for much of the season thus far, depending on timing, Fury had some excellent reasons to be unavailable right here, at around the same time SHIELD medical personnel would also be vanished. I don't know what the timeline is meant to be, how those match up, but, pretty good reasons right there. Only I think the relevant xover episode is still a few weeks away, in which case my point would stand.
Also, was saying to mum, whole series is called Agents of SHIELD. Er, name change?
... Blakes 7 stayed Blakes 7 for years after no more Blake, and their identity probably fits the title even after SHIELD go boom.
And what a way to go boom. Also, I must apologise to the Agents of SHIELD writers, because I didn't know if they knew when SHIELD was being evil. I strongly suspect they do in fact know. Because BOOM! Hydra.
:-D
I was wondering if that was a wimp out, in that it's a way to not claim responsibility for anything SHIELD has ever done wrong, and that's so to some extent. BUT, mostly, I love it, because of who they made HYDRA. Humanity can't be trusted with its own freedom, so they have to be led into giving it up. That... that is such an excellent pitch. Because I can totally see SHIELD and HYDRA having everything in common, with that as the basis. That is the line SHIELD runs right up against, even on its best day, with the best of intentions. I can see an organisation with that as its guiding principle gaining converts. Cause it's like when nazis thought they'd identified evil and could get rid of it once and for all, only with a modern gloss of computers and guns from above. HYDRA becomes the people who think they really can enforce peace through superior firepower and intelligence.
... Tony is going to feel like shit about this one. Seriously, epically, his tech has been part of the near apocalypse, his trust has been screwed over, and he's going to blame himself and be paranoid as all hell. His name was one of the targets, but still, he's going to feel awful.
And he's only tangential to SHIELD.
Actual SHIELD agents? Are one and all going to have to re-evaluate their whole lives.
Because the monster is right there in the mirror, and has been all along.
:-D
HYDRA's plan wouldn't work. For one, they'd used fear of violence from others as the incentive to build up their own 'defensive' forces - suddenly openly becoming the threat would trigger all the responses they'd worked on so carefully, but in a mass reaction against HYDRA. They'd need to maintain the lie to keep the sheeple. But also, the more you tighten your grasp, the more systems slip through your fingers. ... people like to be rebels. Or, more seriously, the more violence happens, the more people have a personal incentive to rethink everything. So I'm pretty sure their plan was a stupid plan, but it was such a Lawful Evil plan I can see why they think it's super smart.
I'm not sure believing the giant face in the computer was the best way to find it out though.
SHIELD being poisoned at source by bringing that guy in... wait, did it say 1972? Because that could be when the SSR people were leaving and replacement people were all how bad could he be. But, poisoned at source by thinking you can use the weapons and science of the enemy? Iiiiiiinteresting.
Also, poor Howard. (And he was murdered by HYDRA in this 'verse? Story!)
Peggy :-)
There were so many good bits.
I like Falcon. Possibly I like him best? Whoosh! Wheee! ... I maybe just like people that fly and/or fall out of buildings on hope. That... actually does cover Tony, Clint, and now Falcon.
I like his background.
Bucky!
Many people left before the end of the credits. Why do people do that?
It's a Marvel movie. Y'all should know by now to wait until the end end of the credits. It's totally worth it.
I was so holding my breath waiting for things to work better for him. (I liked the stuff on tumblr about how Steve should princess kiss him better cause Marvel is Disney now. That would be awesome.) But I guess we will have to wait for more story?
I know from fanfic and fan osmosis a lot about Natasha and Bucky, and I was... puzzled by some of the story choices around Black Widow here. I mean, she's an interesting character if she's actually for reals born in 1984, but she's also pretty interesting in the comics with epic backstory. And someone who doesn't have the same backstory isn't the same person? So why do that? But okay, she's newer.
Black Widow is awesome. She kicked so much arse. Awesome.
I still want to see a movie which is actually about Marvel women. And maybe some merch in the meantime? Even my mum has noticed there's no women, except from her available data she has concluded there are no girl superheroes. She has gone to all these Marvel movies with me and she thinks there are no girl superheroes. That's just fail on Marvel's part. We went in the shops after the movie looking for shiny that must be ours, and in optimum mood for superhero acquisition, but there were only guys, so nothing got bought.
Given the memory tech demonstrated on Bucky and Coulson (and if HYDRA is in SHIELD it's the same tech, yesno?) what Black Widow thinks she knows about Black Widow is not actually the last word on it. Which is weird. But also, Bucky now has a finding himself storyline, right, and a trying to have agency and independence story, and that's a pretty awesome set of stories. Ones often female characters get? Guys fight to save world, women fight to have selves. So that's interesting.
Steve Rogers and girlfriends (and Natasha trying to set him up with, like, all the women) ... several tumblr posts have pointed out that Falcon is the love interest in this. He gets the meet cute, he gets the story bringing him together with Cap, Cap seeking him out just to talk, and then the chance to be there for him. Declares his allegiance full clear. I liked the phrasing, the way the whole 'on your left' bit played through. So the whole movie was about getting them together. That was cute.
So I kind of like that there's a friendship prioritised over the being set up with a girl, and the whole thing with Falcon is super cute, but...
... just niggly stuff, really.
Setting up all the women in his life to be on the wrong side of the lied to him / trust equation? Not actually cool.
It was funny when Natasha was trying to help Steve blend in. Steve is all ready to fight everyone, not so much ready to hide. It's fun watching him be bad at lying and sneaking and, er, acting like an average person. Also I liked that Natasha explained the 'kiss' cover and there was no pouncing.
Some people will probably see this movie and see Steve/Natasha. I see Steve&Natasha, with, like, lots of underlining.
The bad at kissing conversation was kind of funny, except for it being nobody's business. Only now everyone's going to wonder who he's been kissing. Available answers are all wrapped up in tragic.
I don't know why they did that Agent 13 stuff the way they did. I mean, wiki will tell who she is, why introduce that way?
... I may be rearranging the story in my head right now to be more about women.
But there's women to work with, so yaays?
But to watch it was a most excellent experience. I loved the action sequences, to the point of incoherence and big swoopy re-enactment gestures on the way out of the cinema. Whoosh! Boom! But in with all the whoosh I got to really like the characters. All of them. It was great.
Things I liked about the movie: ALL of it!
Things I didn't liked: I got tired and couldn't watch it again straight away.
And excellent about after the film: This movie is going to make soooooo much story :-)
[ETA for those linked here: More Winter Soldier and Agents of SHIELD 1.14 TAHITI have related thoughts]
![[identity profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/openid.png){kind=small}
no subject
Date: 2014-04-06 09:13 pm (UTC)~
no subject
Date: 2014-04-08 09:16 pm (UTC)"... Tony is going to feel like shit about this one. Seriously, epically, his tech has been part of the near apocalypse, his trust has been screwed over, and he's going to blame himself and be paranoid as all hell. His name was one of the targets, but still, he's going to feel awful."
I totally agree. I also want to know if he finds out his parents were actually murdered.
"Actual SHIELD agents? Are one and all going to have to re-evaluate their whole lives."
I was also thinking that especially with what happens in End of the Beginning.
Actually, 1972 was when Zola was turned into the computer. Project Paperclip was MUCH earlier. The timeline appears to be the same as the real one, beginning in 1945.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project_Paperclip